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I aint CPV see in it?
Plumbing
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Ok sure. 馃

Those are spring type gauges and they鈥檙e very unreliable. The worst sold, look it up for yourself

But besides that, the needle flutters and you can鈥檛 get an accurate reading when troubleshooting when the unit is operating and modulating the gas valves.
sure, it flutters, a digital doesnt bounce around either? 馃檮 used it a couple weeks ago on a tankless on a code 12. discovered the flame rod and ignition gasket was half gone from whatever last dipshit serviced it. it gets used pretty often throughout the year, there's quite a few plumbers who install gas piping and are using NG regulators on LP appliances because they just say "regulator" at the counter. They assume one for all and all for one. Hasn't ever failed me. It's ok not to understand my flawless methods.馃
 

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sure, it flutters, a digital doesnt bounce around either? 馃檮 used it a couple weeks ago on a tankless on a code 12. discovered the flame rod and ignition gasket was half gone from whatever last dipshit serviced it. it gets used pretty often throughout the year, there's quite a few plumbers who install gas piping and are using NG regulators on LP appliances because they just say "regulator" at the counter. They assume one for all and all for one. Hasn't ever failed me. It's ok not to understand my flawless methods.馃
I use Maxitrol 325 series regulators. They鈥檙e suitable for natural or LP.

I鈥檓 sorry but those spring type manometers are worthless for troubleshooting the solenoids. I鈥檝e already been through it, that鈥檚 why it鈥檚 in the garbage. But it鈥檚 fine if you want to use it.
 

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As you can see the max and min fire rates for the burner side of the manifold. You can鈥檛 get that accuracy with that spring gauge down to .4鈥 Wc. You set these pressures when you replace the brain board of the unit or you switch manifolds and convert to a different type gas
Font Parallel Rectangle Pattern Number
 

I aint CPV see in it?
Plumbing
Joined
5,281 Posts
I use Maxitrol 325 series regulators. They鈥檙e suitable for natural or LP.

I鈥檓 sorry but those spring type manometers are worthless for troubleshooting the solenoids. I鈥檝e already been through it, that鈥檚 why it鈥檚 in the garbage. But it鈥檚 fine if you want to use it.
What do they come set at out of the box?
 

philosopher and statesmen
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We used to repair gas leaks and I used to have an old style one but that was
back a long time ago maybe 40 years ago ........
I have never needed one or had the need for one like forever..
Dont even remember how to use it any longer......
 

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We used to repair gas leaks and I used to have an old style one but that was
back a long time ago maybe 40 years ago ........
I have never needed one or had the need for one like forever..
Dont even remember how to use it any longer......
You don鈥檛 test the gas system for leaks after you install gas water heaters and replace the gas valve or modify the piping ?

Every time I turn the gas off at a meter or alter gas piping I check the entire system for leaks using a manometer and soap the fittings in the area that I worked.
 

philosopher and statesmen
Joined
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You don鈥檛 test the gas system for leaks after you install gas water heaters and replace the gas valve or modify the piping ?

Every time I turn the gas off at a meter or alter gas piping I check the entire system for leaks using a manometer and soap the fittings in the area that I worked.
I think we are talking about two different things... re-piping a house and
just doing a water heater


So why would you turn off the whole house just to change out
a simple water heater when you have a ball valve on the manifold
or on the water heater?? Are you pumping them for more work trying
to find something to charge for??

Generally I use soap and a spray bottle on my installs,
which is just a simple water heater change out....
but its sort of overkill to test the whole house unless you
are like a bull in a china shop....


if you want to see some real slop go here

 

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I think we are talking about two different things... re-piping a house and
just doing a water heater

So why would you turn off the whole house just to change out
a simple water heater when you have a ball valve on the manifold
or on the water heater?? Are you pumping them for more work trying
to find something to charge for??

Generally I use soap and a spray bottle on my installs,
which is just a simple water heater change out....
but its sort of overkill to test the whole house unless you
are like a bull in a china shop....


if you want to see some real slop go here

If I go to a home to replace a water heater and for any reason the gas must be turned off at the meter then upon turning the meter back on I test the tightness of the system.

Various scenarios could come up where the gas should be shut down. Use your imagination.

Its called due diligence.
 

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Ok sure. 馃

Those are spring type gauges and they鈥檙e very unreliable. The worst sold, look it up for yourself

But besides that, the needle flutters and you can鈥檛 get an accurate reading when troubleshooting when the unit is operating and modulating the gas valves.
Do you feel the need to always prescribe to another professional (a peer) what does and doesn鈥檛 work?

One of the most accurate methods for measuring dynamic and on the market is analog. It鈥檚 a tube bent in a u-shape with water in it and a ruler; this is how all manometers are calibrated. Another analog device is a Capsihelic; these are considered far more accurate than most digital manometers; and they can be calibrated by static and span pressures.

If an analog manometer works for what a professional needs it to do, it鈥檚 fine.
 

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Do you feel the need to always prescribe to another professional (a peer) what does and doesn鈥檛 work?

One of the most accurate methods for measuring dynamic and on the market is analog. It鈥檚 a tube bent in a u-shape with water in it and a ruler; this is how all manometers are calibrated. Another analog device is a Capsihelic; these are considered far more accurate than most digital manometers; and they can be calibrated by static and span pressures.

If an analog manometer works for what a professional needs it to do, it鈥檚 fine.
Because it鈥檚 not suitable to work on some problems that you can encounter. Call Rinnai and ask their tech support why their engineers require a digital manometer for troubleshooting then you鈥檒l have an answer from someone other than me.

You just don鈥檛 understand how a tankless water heater works or you wouldn鈥檛 have posted what you鈥檝e posted. You鈥檙e making an emotional issue out of a mechanical one鈥︹..it鈥檚 nothing personal buddy.

For dynamic testing the digital manometer is the proper tool for tankless water heater trouble shooting and other gas appliances that use modulating solenoids.

That鈥檚 my opinion after servicing tankless and pool heating equipment and that鈥檚 Rinnai opinion as well.

You鈥檙e welcome to have any opinion you鈥檇 like about me and or the content of my posts. Have a great day.
 

philosopher and statesmen
Joined
8,591 Posts
Terry you got a link to the one you have? Also, a sniffer or do you just hit the joints with a lighter?
I just use a lighter myself... if I burn my eyebrows off
then I know I got a leak......
... 馃槅 馃槅 馃槅 馃槅 馃槅
 

philosopher and statesmen
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If I go to a home to replace a water heater and for any reason the gas must be turned off at the meter then upon turning the meter back on I test the tightness of the system.

Various scenarios could come up where the gas should be shut down. Use your imagination.

Its called due diligence.

No, its not due diligence --its lecturing

you are just doing what the left wing liberals do so well these days...

you are "virtue signaling" everyone on a plumbing forum...

next you are probably gonna start calling everyone a racist or a hack
cause they do things different than you....


its a fuc/ing water heater.... get over it
 

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You don鈥檛 test the gas system for leaks after you install gas water heaters and replace the gas valve or modify the piping ?

Every time I turn the gas off at a meter or alter gas piping I check the entire system for leaks using a manometer and soap the fittings in the area that I worked.
It may be just a difference in local protocols, but in the case of a spot repair or valve replacement we only have to test the section we were working on with bubbles or a sniffer. Modifying the system (adding piping, converting fuel types or pressures) mandates an air test with an analog guage at 10-20 psi. That was both here in Missouri and back in Texas. Manometers are only specified for use in troubleshooting regulators and valves. I've done plenty of tankless and the manufacturers tech support has never required a digital manometer.

Please keep in mind that we don't all use the same codes, and not all methods are required or even approved by our local AHJ. Telling another professional that they are doing it wrong because it's not the way you do it comes across pretty heavy handed.
 

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It may be just a difference in local protocols, but in the case of a spot repair or valve replacement we only have to test the section we were working on with bubbles or a sniffer. Modifying the system (adding piping, converting fuel types or pressures) mandates an air test with an analog guage at 10-20 psi. That was both here in Missouri and back in Texas. Manometers are only specified for use in troubleshooting regulators and valves. I've done plenty of tankless and the manufacturers tech support has never required a digital manometer.

Please keep in mind that we don't all use the same codes, and not all methods are required or even approved by our local AHJ. Telling another professional that they are doing it wrong because it's not the way you do it comes across pretty heavy handed.
Rinnai requires a digital manometer to set the various manifold pressures. You鈥檙e setting pressures down to the .4鈥 water column and the gas valves modulate very quickly. It鈥檚 the proper tool for the job, per me and rinnai engineers.

I鈥檓 explaining my posts, not asking to agree and you鈥檙e welcome to your opinion.

When I shut a system down, like gas, I always check the system for leaks. Is it code in your area ? I don鈥檛 know but it鈥檚 due diligence when you鈥檙e dealing with an explosive gas.

I鈥檝e found many unknown leaks by checking the system tightness upon putting it back in service after any reason. Some dangerous, some not dangerous. A digital manometer is a quick way to check, so is a water tube manometer. The spring type are trash, sorry if that offends, that鈥檚 my opinion and experience.

Every leak that I鈥檝e found like that was a win for me, extra work and a win for the customer because they鈥檙e safer and they鈥檙e not wasting gas.

Thank you for the discussion
 

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To be clear, when I turn the gas meter off for any type of service, upon turning the system on, I use a manometer to test static gas pressure and system tightness.

I don鈥檛 test repair or alterations with air or nitrogen. Just the gas that鈥檚 being used at its delivery pressure.

It鈥檚 not about satisfying a code. It鈥檚 my due diligence IMO to leave the customer with a tight gas system after I鈥檝e turned the main off and back on for ANY purpose.

When the gas supplier replaces a gas meter or they turn the gas off for any purpose they check the system for tightness. I concur and I follow their example.
 

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No, its not due diligence --its lecturing

you are just doing what the left wing liberals do so well these days...

you are "virtue signaling" everyone on a plumbing forum...

next you are probably gonna start calling everyone a racist or a hack
cause they do things different than you....


its a fuc/ing water heater.... get over it
I鈥檓 sorry you feel that way.

It鈥檚 due diligence is how my insurance agent and attorney explained it to me.

Usually the last person that was at the house working on the gas systems gets the blame or at least part of blame when an accident happens.

So it鈥檚 best to check and document the gas pressure and do a simple leak test.

This can generate more work when you identify leaks. It can keep the customer safe.

Every 6 months I meet with my insurance agent and lawyer. We talk about liabilities and ways to help protect yourself.


Why do you think utility trucks put cones out around their trucks in parking lots when they鈥檙e not even working ? Because their insurance company told them to.

Look, I鈥檓 just dropping free knowledge and having a business/plumbing discussion on a professional forum.

I鈥檓 not asking anyone to agree or disagree. I鈥檓 posting my experience and what鈥檚 been passed on to me by the professionals I work for and with.

If anyone would like me to stop responding to their posts or communicating with them in any way shape or form, I will honor and respect that request.

For all others that want to have discussion with me, please let鈥檚 continue.

Im going to be taking care of some things over the next few weeks and won鈥檛 be around much anyway.

I hope everyone has a great Monday, or as best as a Monday can be. See you later 鉁
 

I aint CPV see in it?
Plumbing
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Ight鈥, there is nothing anyone could ever say about my work methods that I would ever give 2 fcks about. I just don鈥檛 care. I do enjoy watching the youth cry about it though while drinking their white claw. 馃槀

just discussions is all it is to me.
 
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