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Certified Lunatic
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Discussion Starter #1
For some time I have been posting telling people to avoid Watts Floodsafe supplies for Toilets, Faucets, Icemakers, Dishwashers, and Washing Machines.

I have been posting telling of how I had a customer have one break at the compression connector to the Floodsafe Valve connection point causing a lot of water damage to his home.



The day I did that job I did not have a camera with me to get a picture of the evidence. The Floodsafe Supply was not installed by me as I was already avoiding them because of the nuisance trips that are fairly well known to happen with them. The supply was retained by the customer as evidence.

Recently a person seeing one of my posts on this connection failure E-Mailed me photo's of the same thing happening at his house. A Watts Floodsafe Dishwasher Supply failed at the same connection that I was talking about. The connector was not over tightened, 1/3 of a turn with the wrench and the compression connector was turning by hand, pressure was 70 PSI. the valve just blew apart on it's own flooding the house and causing about $25K in damage maybe higher if the entire wood floor has to come up or, just the kitchen portion.

In his own words, "I think the valve was poorly manufactured or damaged during manufacture. Like I said before, no freeze, no physical damage I could see. Just blew all by itself. Bury Watts all you want, this product is crap."

Here is a picture of the failed connector under the sink.


Here is a picture of the failed connector. Note how the connection between the compression fitting and the safety valve is where the failure occurred. This left the compression fitting on the stop valve spraying water while the safety valve blew off.


Here is a picture of the label on the failed Watts Floodsafe Dishwasher Supply.


This is a picture of the flooded kitchen hardwood floor.


This is a picture of the ceiling below the kitchen prior to demo.


And this is the picture of the same area after demo.
 

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Professional Bullshioter
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6,092 Posts
I know they take longer, but I do love rigid supplies.
 

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Banned
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Has anyone ever tried the white colored pex 3/8 risers? My rep gave me a handful to try, haven't used them yet but they seem like they would work pretty good.
 

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Has anyone ever tried the white colored pex 3/8 risers? My rep gave me a handful to try, haven't used them yet but they seem like they would work pretty good.
Yes they work just fine. I have installed allot in the past.
 

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Professional Bullshioter
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I've never used one. Do they require an inner stiffener at the compression joint?
 

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No, but you need to use the plastic compression sleeve
 

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www.DunbarPlumbing.com
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Not to rain on the parade, but those pex risers have a habit of snaping off right at the edge of the ferrule and nut after 10-12 years if there's any bend in the line.

They harden up like every plastic does, then becomes brittle. If someone really turns a hard bend in the product, like for a toilet riser, that line will split right at the upper part of the turn.

I might be able to muster a few pictures of this, and new construction plumbers habitually use those damn brass ferrules which cut right into the edge of plastic.
 

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200 Posts
i avoid anything with the WATTS name on it. a few years ago i was pushing the WATTS intelliflow washing machine valves...i eventually replaced about every damn i of them..about 30 or so. WATTS said they had not heard of any problems...BS. stay away from WATTS
 

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Chase Plumber
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289 Posts
That's why it says "turn the water on SLOWLY".

They know if you turn it on after installing and the hammer surge hits, it'll bust right in your face, haha.
 

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Banned
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8,808 Posts
Not to rain on the parade, but those pex risers have a habit of snaping off right at the edge of the ferrule and nut after 10-12 years if there's any bend in the line.

They harden up like every plastic does, then becomes brittle. If someone really turns a hard bend in the product, like for a toilet riser, that line will split right at the upper part of the turn.

I might be able to muster a few pictures of this, and new construction plumbers habitually use those damn brass ferrules which cut right into the edge of plastic.
That's why I said use the plastic ferrules, compression sleeve.
 

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www.DunbarPlumbing.com
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5,478 Posts



I will say, I've seen more failures with brass ferrules than plastic by far.


I posted the above picture in 2006 somewhere on the internet and described how many thousands of dollars it cost in property damage.


When people have these gray or white ones in their home, I tell them they are on borrowed time as where the ferrules compress to the piping, they become brittle. I've seen the fused tops pop off as well, but always leak before blowing apart.

It's the cheapest supply line on the market and when they bust, it's always property damage. With copper it is usually noticed sooner than later of the problem and doesn't "abruptly" fail.

I used those back in the early 90's but stopped for the reason that I felt I was being too much of a risk taker, following the idea of servicing those same customer years from then.

I don't work for them anymore; a lot of them died off. I guess I'm next. :cry:



Guess how many thousands this plastic nut cost a homeowner...



Nobody was home when it broke loose, abruptly.
 

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Plumber Manhattan Beach
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828 Posts
What about deltas new kitchen faucet that comes with the supplies already installed? to new of a product to give an opinion on? I personaly don't like it. I like to use the braided stainless supply lines.

I hate flood safe, I have had to many stick and cause pressure problems.

junk.
 

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in the early days all i used was brass and chrome plated brass supplys. ive gotten into the pex lav supplys w/ plastic ferrules, and braided stainless closet supplies. i have not had any problems but i have been kickin around the idea of going back to old school. i didnt have problems w/ metal and i havent had problems w/ plastic. i feel im being pushed toward what is cheaper rather than what is a little more and proven.
 

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What about deltas new kitchen faucet that comes with the supplies already installed? to new of a product to give an opinion on? I personaly don't like it. I like to use the braided stainless supply lines.

I hate flood safe, I have had to many stick and cause pressure problems.

junk.
Braided lines and poly lines are illegal in Chicago, some inspectors frown on 3/8 OD lines and would prefer to see 1/2 OD lines on all fixtures.
 

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residential service
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1,948 Posts



I will say, I've seen more failures with brass ferrules than plastic by far.


I posted the above picture in 2006 somewhere on the internet and described how many thousands of dollars it cost in property damage.


When people have these gray or white ones in their home, I tell them they are on borrowed time as where the ferrules compress to the piping, they become brittle. I've seen the fused tops pop off as well, but always leak before blowing apart.

It's the cheapest supply line on the market and when they bust, it's always property damage. With copper it is usually noticed sooner than later of the problem and doesn't "abruptly" fail.

I used those back in the early 90's but stopped for the reason that I felt I was being too much of a risk taker, following the idea of servicing those same customer years from then.

I don't work for them anymore; a lot of them died off. I guess I'm next. :cry:



Guess how many thousands this plastic nut cost a homeowner...



Nobody was home when it broke loose, abruptly.
Holy cow we agree completely on something! I have installed probably hundreds of these when I was doing new con. The first time I found one fractured like that was the day I went back to soft copper supplies. I have not installed another pex supply since. I use pex routinely and have no problem doing so but no more pex supplies for me. I have seen many failed pex supplies.

Can I use your photos?
 
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