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Always Something
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I don't know how new it is for you, but I am just starting to hear about this and was talking to a guy from the San Diego area and he said two cities have approved this new ammendment. No more than 30 seconds to any HW fixture in the home. For those that don't know, we (those of us in CA) are in a "drought"..so they say. Aside from the L.A. DWP now able to hit people with fines for too much water usage now there are places that want to regulate how long it takes to get HW to a fixture. I can't imagine things like this where cross connections are not allowed. Can you imagine not passing final on a remod or new build because it takes 35 seconds to get HW to the lav? I think it's another form of socialism
 

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I don't know how new it is for you, but I am just starting to hear about this and was talking to a guy from the San Diego area and he said two cities have approved this new ammendment. No more than 30 seconds to any HW fixture in the home. For those that don't know, we (those of us in CA) are in a "drought"..so they say. Aside from the L.A. DWP now able to hit people with fines for too much water usage now there are places that want to regulate how long it takes to get HW to a fixture. I can't imagine things like this where cross connections are not allowed. Can you imagine not passing final on a remod or new build because it takes 35 seconds to get HW to the lav? I think it's another form of socialism
That's taken right out of the ASPE Domestic Hot Water Heating Design Manual.

Mark
 

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Hey RSP,

Unless that water heater in your picture is facing to the rear, the hot and cold line are plumbed in backwards, I always thought cold was to enter the right said of the heater on the top. Am I wrong? :laughing:
 

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Always Something
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
As do I, and I have talked at length with Larry. It's a good solution for most, but there is a fair amount of people that either have (a recirc line) or want instant hot all the time. On large custom homes I rarly get HO's that are interested in pushing buttons of having motion sensors installed. Like I said, for most yes Metlund design works well enough and does maintain the full warranty on Tankless heaters too.

I have a feeling HW distribution and energy consumption is going to change alot in the next decade or two.
 

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I aint CPV see in it?
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Hey RSP,

Unless that water heater in your picture is facing to the rear, the hot and cold line are plumbed in backwards, I always thought cold was to enter the right said of the heater on the top. Am I wrong? :laughing:
Toche' ron. That a water heater on the other side of the hemisphere!!!!!!!!
 

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Always Something
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
That's taken right out of the ASPE Domestic Hot Water Heating Design Manual.

Mark

Do you know of actual cities that now require it?
 

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Do you know of actual cities that now require it?
Not yet. There was a period where Las Vegas was requiring circ systems on all homes but that is as close as it got.

Mark
 

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Water Whisperer
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Is it a drought or over-building?

I mean, if you have only so much water, a finite supply, and you've known it since Day One, how come they built like it was not a problem?

The good thing is that the homeowners will jump on the slightest leak. Here, only 10% of the homes are metered, so nobody cares about leaking pipes unless its undermining the building.
 

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Seems like extra $$$ for us if it is required on every house. I wonder if your crunched the numbers if the extra electric used to run a circ pump would out weigh the 30 secs it takes for hot water to reach a tap. Solve one problem, but create another...the American way!
 

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I aint CPV see in it?
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The metlund pump is an on demand system. It only runs when you want it to, and cuts off as soon as the water reaches a hot enough temp. Doesnt run constantly. Maybe runs up to thiry to forty seconds at the most.
 

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Always Something
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The metlund pump is an on demand system. It only runs when you want it to, and cuts off as soon as the water reaches a hot enough temp. Doesnt run constantly. Maybe runs up to thiry to forty seconds at the most.
It runs untill there is a 10 degree rise in temp.

There is a pot inside the units that you can adjust to increase or decrease the temp rise cutoff point. Tankless units get adjusted to a slightly higher temp (1/8th) of a turn CCW. Out of the box, they are fine for tanked heaters. You doing many of the motion sensor installs? I have done a few...works ok I guess.
 

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No motion sensor installs, I try to lean away from them. You dont need that thing cutting on when you walk in the bathroom just to take a leak. I do use the wireless remotes though. Put a couple through the home though.
 

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Always Something
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I have put a bunch on recirc lines at the heater location....works well, but on long 1/2" return lines I have gone with the 02 big boy, otherwise it can take a long time to recirc. I will still check them as I do not have much faith in Larry's impeller / check design. He got his ratings and he cares about that...alot.... I have seen the internal checks fail on more than one ocassion.

For all who want to know:

To determin the amount of time it will take the metlund pump (just a taco) go to the furthest fixture (unless you are attempting to do something else or have a funky home layout) and turn the hot tap on the lav sink and time it. That is just about the time it will take for the Metlund to cycle for you. The pump runs between 1.6 to 2.5 GPM depending on head. About the same as a std lav. You can also time it to other fixtures that get picked up along the way (easier sales) especially for the kitchen. I have installed maybe 60 or 80 of these things and maybe only 2 or so call backs for repair...not too bad for a new design. I find that if you properly explain exactly how these systems work most people are very happy with them.
 
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