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Old 09-08-2017, 02:29 PM   #1
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Was talking with a guy today about how his previous employer and some of the guys he knows currently working there were able to take their journeyman test after only having 3200-4000 hours in under a master, which I already doubted because the board of plumbing site said otherwise.

In any case, I figured I would humor myself and call because I have over 6k hours, probably more because I don't have all of my pay stubs with proof of my hours. In anycase, I call city hall and ask and the lady is completely oblivious but told me to contact one of the members of the board. So, I call one of the board members and he didn't know either, and told me he would get back to me. 10 minutes later he returns my call and boy did my world get flipped upside down.

Turns out, I was right by referring to the board of plumbing site, 8k hours. What I didn't know, is that you had to be registered with the city as a licensed apprentice, nor did my employer. Actually, a lot of masters probably don't know that because the rule of thumb was, as long as you had the proof you were working under a master you would be credited and it doesn't state that in the board of plumbing site.

So, being that I was only registered in 2014 and this current year, all my experience means absolutely nothing. He told me that because of recent problems with people going for their license, they're cracking down. They told me that I could have been digging ditches and only that since 2008 regardless or not I have the proof of hours working for a master. I mean, honestly, I could have just done the same thing while registered as an apprentice, so that's a pretty flawed argument.

In any case, I asked if a letter of referal from my boss on a company letter head would suffice as proof, he told me it wouldn't matter. He said it wasn't about the hours, as much as it was about the amount of years you held the apprentice card...heh. So basically, regardless of how long and how many hours I've put in, it means jack **** because i don't have a piece of paper the size of a business card stating I was an apprentice.

He said I could go in front of the board of plumbers and argue it, but I feel like it would be a waste of time. I'm going to dig deeper, but who knows what that will unturn. In any case, PA is county based, so it's not like my hours matter else where. I think I'm about ready to just ditch this place and move. If I gotta restart anyways, might as well go somewhere with more opportunities and where time in will matter. They wonder why people are running away from trades, is because of **** barriers they create because they don't want others stepping on their feet, when there is enough work for everyone.

Great way to end the week and ruin the weekend.
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Old 09-08-2017, 06:11 PM   #2
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You need to blame this on your boss.... he should
have known about this and he should be willing to go up
against the board and plead ignorance on his part...

someone has to get that apprentice card and pay the dues on it...
he should have put it under his name....

I dont know what goes on in your state but
in this state I am liable and am supposed to register every employee I
get as an apprentice... because they are also supposed to be going to
a plumbing class once a week down town... and it is supposed to be mandatory.. Most of these num-nuts dont want to go .....

the problem is they cannot or will not pay for the class so it falls on me to
pay for the class and take it slowly out of their pay........'

Of course this does not work out and they usually quit the class after a few weeks and then I got troubles .....

you need to look into this more and get on your boss for not keeping everything on the up and up.......
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Old 09-08-2017, 06:26 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Mark View Post
You need to blame this on your boss.... he should
have known about this and he should be willing to go up
against the board and plead ignorance on his part...

someone has to get that apprentice card and pay the dues on it...
he should have put it under his name....

I dont know what goes on in your state but
in this state I am liable and am supposed to register every employee I
get as an apprentice... because they are also supposed to be going to
a plumbing class once a week down town... and it is supposed to be mandatory.. Most of these num-nuts dont want to go .....

the problem is they cannot or will not pay for the class so it falls on me to
pay for the class and take it slowly out of their pay........'

Of course this does not work out and they usually quit the class after a few weeks and then I got troubles .....

you need to look into this more and get on your boss for not keeping everything on the up and up.......
.

I agree it should be on him, but at the same time the board should be more clear on regulations. I told him I was not allowed to get the card myself and it was the masters responsibility to get the card because if not any yayhoo could walk in and get one. I told him over and over 2015 and 2016. Finally got him to get one for 2017. The schooling part was mandatory until 2009 but because not enough people were attending the classes, they shut the classes down and removed that as being part of the requirement.

Unfortunately, because of this a lot of the masters around here are under the assumption that you just need proof of working under a master and the board isn't enforcing it until I guess people like myself who are ambitious and are ready and willing to take the test can't. I wish there were classes here and that they were mandatory. I'd attend them. I think it would filter out a lot of the weasels.

I am going to consult with other members of the board, but if the end result is me having nothing to show regardless of time put in, why bother continuing plumbing here.
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Old 09-09-2017, 08:58 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oorgnid View Post
.

I agree it should be on him, but at the same time the board should be more clear on regulations. I told him I was not allowed to get the card myself and it was the masters responsibility to get the card because if not any yayhoo could walk in and get one. I told him over and over 2015 and 2016. Finally got him to get one for 2017. The schooling part was mandatory until 2009 but because not enough people were attending the classes, they shut the classes down and removed that as being part of the requirement.

Unfortunately, because of this a lot of the masters around here are under the assumption that you just need proof of working under a master and the board isn't enforcing it until I guess people like myself who are ambitious and are ready and willing to take the test can't. I wish there were classes here and that they were mandatory. I'd attend them. I think it would filter out a lot of the weasels.

I am going to consult with other members of the board, but if the end result is me having nothing to show regardless of time put in, why bother continuing plumbing here.


You are 1 in a 100 .... most refuse to go to school

I sort of wish they would kill off the classes here too.. its basically all a joke and no one wants to attend... because there is too much drinking to do on the night of that class at some strip club......
Its like they are being forced to make something out of themselves and they are pissed off about it. .

This is something I would need to get a masters degree in psychology to completely understand..... They have some deep , deep issues that must bubble up when someone tries to help them better themselves..????.. Its like.... "you are not gonna force me to grow brains...no way"""

Then eventually they quit the class and I guess I am supposed to fire them and then go out and find another flunkey helper....

I have done this about 3 times and I have got stuck with the bill twice.

So now I will not hire someone and get them an apprentice card ever again you try to force them to go to school and they see it as punishment and will quit you and move on before they fail at class...

Recently, I kept one guy employed for 6 years without a card, and of course he got divorced and moved on to Arizona in 2014 so I avoided the fight to make him go to class... So I got 6 quiet, easy, smooth years out of him instead of only 1. .
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Old 09-09-2017, 11:55 AM   #5
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Unfortunately there aren't many employers here that want to run a business the way you do. Most want to pay you cash or 1099 and are shady. Would love to work for an employer who is serious about the trade but I digress. I'll figure something out. Working for the state didn't fall through because it's all commercial and would mostly be in the prison and my experience is pretty much all residential. So they went with someone who had more commercial experience.
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Old 09-09-2017, 02:16 PM   #6
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How did your boss become a licensed plumber? He surely must know about having to register an apprentice. He may be concealing this from you.

Ask him about whether or not he knew about having to register you as an apprentice. But do it in a round-about way; don't confront him with a direct question. If he knew but kept this from you, then I'd leave him in a heartbeat. He would have known that your time was for nothing with regard to counting towards your license. That is a real douche if he did that.
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Old 09-09-2017, 02:22 PM   #7
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How did your boss become a licensed plumber? He surely must know about having to register an apprentice. He may be concealing this from you.

Ask him about whether or not he knew about having to register you as an apprentice. But do it in a round-about way; don't confront him with a direct question. If he knew but kept this from you, then I'd leave him in a heartbeat. He would have known that your time was for nothing with regard to counting towards your license. That is a real douche if he did that.
It's really hard to say. He's not the only master that has been led to think you didn't need to register your apprentices. He's a registered master plumber for sure. I know this because I've seen his card and the fact that he pulls permits in the city. I've been looking to leave for awhile now. Unfortunately there is no where to go and I can't just quit on a whim without an income.

With the hurricane coming, did you evacuate Florida, Tommy?
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Old 09-09-2017, 09:11 PM   #8
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It's really hard to say. He's not the only master that has been led to think you didn't need to register your apprentices. He's a registered master plumber for sure. I know this because I've seen his card and the fact that he pulls permits in the city. I've been looking to leave for awhile now. Unfortunately there is no where to go and I can't just quit on a whim without an income.

With the hurricane coming, did you evacuate Florida, Tommy?











No. Roads are jammed; gas is in short supply, and hotels are filled to capacity all the way up to Atlanta. Folks who try to flee sometimes find that the storm follows them and then catches them. I would not want to be stuck out on the roads when the storm hits. We usually hunker down and ride it out.
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Old 09-09-2017, 10:04 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oorgnid View Post
It's really hard to say. He's not the only master that has been led to think you didn't need to register your apprentices. He's a registered master plumber for sure. I know this because I've seen his card and the fact that he pulls permits in the city. I've been looking to leave for awhile now. Unfortunately there is no where to go and I can't just quit on a whim without an income.

With the hurricane coming, did you evacuate Florida, Tommy?











No. Roads are jammed; gas is in short supply, and hotels are filled to capacity all the way up to Atlanta. Folks who try to flee sometimes find that the storm follows them and then catches them. I would not want to be stuck out on the roads when the storm hits. We usually hunker down and ride it out.
Good thinking. Be safe, hope you and your family have enough provisions.
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Old 09-10-2017, 12:33 AM   #10
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No. Roads are jammed; gas is in short supply, and hotels are filled to capacity all the way up to Atlanta. Folks who try to flee sometimes find that the storm follows them and then catches them. I would not want to be stuck out on the roads when the storm hits. We usually hunker down and ride it out.
What part of Florida are you in tomcat???
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