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Watts Floodsafe? Not Very!

26K views 39 replies 19 participants last post by  para1 
#1 ·
For some time I have been posting telling people to avoid Watts Floodsafe supplies for Toilets, Faucets, Icemakers, Dishwashers, and Washing Machines.

I have been posting telling of how I had a customer have one break at the compression connector to the Floodsafe Valve connection point causing a lot of water damage to his home.



The day I did that job I did not have a camera with me to get a picture of the evidence. The Floodsafe Supply was not installed by me as I was already avoiding them because of the nuisance trips that are fairly well known to happen with them. The supply was retained by the customer as evidence.

Recently a person seeing one of my posts on this connection failure E-Mailed me photo's of the same thing happening at his house. A Watts Floodsafe Dishwasher Supply failed at the same connection that I was talking about. The connector was not over tightened, 1/3 of a turn with the wrench and the compression connector was turning by hand, pressure was 70 PSI. the valve just blew apart on it's own flooding the house and causing about $25K in damage maybe higher if the entire wood floor has to come up or, just the kitchen portion.

In his own words, "I think the valve was poorly manufactured or damaged during manufacture. Like I said before, no freeze, no physical damage I could see. Just blew all by itself. Bury Watts all you want, this product is crap."

Here is a picture of the failed connector under the sink.


Here is a picture of the failed connector. Note how the connection between the compression fitting and the safety valve is where the failure occurred. This left the compression fitting on the stop valve spraying water while the safety valve blew off.


Here is a picture of the label on the failed Watts Floodsafe Dishwasher Supply.


This is a picture of the flooded kitchen hardwood floor.


This is a picture of the ceiling below the kitchen prior to demo.


And this is the picture of the same area after demo.
 
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#7 ·
Not to rain on the parade, but those pex risers have a habit of snaping off right at the edge of the ferrule and nut after 10-12 years if there's any bend in the line.

They harden up like every plastic does, then becomes brittle. If someone really turns a hard bend in the product, like for a toilet riser, that line will split right at the upper part of the turn.

I might be able to muster a few pictures of this, and new construction plumbers habitually use those damn brass ferrules which cut right into the edge of plastic.
 
#35 ·
I beat Watts to the patent on this product with the addition of a sensor in the pan to shut of flow of power and water. This is also the basis of their water heater control. It proved unreliable in long term testing on my part, I'm glad the whole picture has been seen on their part for infringing on my idea and not comunicating with me for the sake of the almighty dollar.
 
#11 · (Edited)



I will say, I've seen more failures with brass ferrules than plastic by far.


I posted the above picture in 2006 somewhere on the internet and described how many thousands of dollars it cost in property damage.


When people have these gray or white ones in their home, I tell them they are on borrowed time as where the ferrules compress to the piping, they become brittle. I've seen the fused tops pop off as well, but always leak before blowing apart.

It's the cheapest supply line on the market and when they bust, it's always property damage. With copper it is usually noticed sooner than later of the problem and doesn't "abruptly" fail.

I used those back in the early 90's but stopped for the reason that I felt I was being too much of a risk taker, following the idea of servicing those same customer years from then.

I don't work for them anymore; a lot of them died off. I guess I'm next. :cry:



Guess how many thousands this plastic nut cost a homeowner...



Nobody was home when it broke loose, abruptly.
 
#20 ·
Holy cow we agree completely on something! I have installed probably hundreds of these when I was doing new con. The first time I found one fractured like that was the day I went back to soft copper supplies. I have not installed another pex supply since. I use pex routinely and have no problem doing so but no more pex supplies for me. I have seen many failed pex supplies.

Can I use your photos?
 
#12 ·
What about deltas new kitchen faucet that comes with the supplies already installed? to new of a product to give an opinion on? I personaly don't like it. I like to use the braided stainless supply lines.

I hate flood safe, I have had to many stick and cause pressure problems.

junk.
 
#13 ·
in the early days all i used was brass and chrome plated brass supplys. ive gotten into the pex lav supplys w/ plastic ferrules, and braided stainless closet supplies. i have not had any problems but i have been kickin around the idea of going back to old school. i didnt have problems w/ metal and i havent had problems w/ plastic. i feel im being pushed toward what is cheaper rather than what is a little more and proven.
 
#27 ·
I am not defending nor supporting any item or manufacturer but, with all the p*ssing and moaning about this s*cks or that stuff is crap , did any of you stop to think about the person who installed it. Was he/she any smarter than the object they installed? I found most failures are due to poor installation or the wrong application for the product.
 
#36 ·
I'm sure the gray tubes in the pictures are polybutylene, not PEX. I've used a lot of them, and seen a lot of them, and have yet to see one that failed. As I've posted many times on these forums, my own house is plumbed in polybutylene and I've never had any problem at all. Of course, I've never used brass ferrules with plastic tubes.

They still sell the polybutylene tubes in a lot of stores.

I think the secret's in the water - we don't have chlorine. The chlorinated water will destroy the small tubes as easily as it destroyed large PB under city streets if chlorine is present.

These days, I mostly use braided Fluidmaster flexes. Those aren't perfect, either. But they're better quality than a lot of other supplies.
 
#37 ·
The grey water supplies in the pictures are not pex, you're right, they are polybutylene and they do get very brittle over time. I've had a ton of them break right in half when removing them.
The actual pex risers will not just "snap" or get hard over time. You do have to use the plastic type ferrules and you do have to use the inserts according to Viega, all supplies are in the Viega catalog. Also, the Viega Pex risers I'm starting to use are chlorine resistant as is all Viega piping.
These 3/8" Pex risers made by Viega have been in use for over 25 years according to the company without any problems. They are snow white in color and actually look very attractive when installed in a white bathroom for a toilet supply.
Myself I just started using them and like them so far. Are they cheaper? You bet they are, less than a buck each with nuts, insert and ferrule.
I'll keep using them for service work for now unless I hear something different.
 
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