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Old 10-09-2011, 12:38 PM   #1
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Default cycle stop valves

we use these valves all the time, i/we love these valves. the csv is an alternative to vfd based pumping systems, meaning that constant pressure is held on well systems, a constant speed pump can be installed in a constant pressure application using the csv, instead of the pump cycling causing a flucuation in pressure (pain in the arse when taking a shower or on an irrigation system because the spray radius is constanly changing every time the pump cycles) the pressure is held constant. uneven cycling can damage a pump and even when a proper pressure tank is picked out and the pump cycles evenly ware and tear is still put on the pump and distribution infrastructure, a smaller pressure tank can used when a csv is implamented, the csv also prevents dead heading of the pump, on smaller valves 1 gpm is let past the valve seat, and on larger valves 5 gpm, this allows the p-tank to fill up when no demand is present. pressure flucuations and bounce back can cause damge to piping and p-tanks, the csv eliminates this. i thought i would start this thread to provide information on the product incase anyone wants to use this product, also has anyone here ever used a csv? i do not work for the company that makes csv's i just know alot about them cause i used them when i worked in the irrgation industry and now i use them with the plumbo-co i work for, so i figured it wouldnt hurt to educate yall on them, it might help someone. heres the link to the manurfacers website incase anyone wants to see what they look like or learn more about them. http://cyclestopvalves.com/index2.html




the csv we typicly use on a residential submerisible well pump, 24 gpm max on this one, but they make bigger vlaves that can handle flows in the thousands

Last edited by Mississippiplum; 10-10-2011 at 03:27 PM.. Reason: to add picture
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Old 10-13-2011, 05:58 PM   #2
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Pretty decent product. Are they (the valves) reliable? I enjoyed the tutorial on their website. I'm a picture person.....
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:26 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy plumber
Pretty decent product. Are they (the valves) reliable? I enjoyed the tutorial on their website. I'm a picture person.....
The valves are extremely reliable because there is no electronic parts or such in them, and because threres only a single moving part in them, I'm a picture person too.
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Old 12-17-2011, 12:23 PM   #4
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On a residential well system with a submersible pump, this takes place of the pressure switch or wires through it? I have not done much commercial plumbing and the outfit that i work for only has 2 maybe 3 residential clients that have constant pressure pumps and they are Franklin's with the big sub drive control boxes.. This little guy replaces all that?

I tried to watch the animations from the link to better understand but they aren't wanting to load from my iPhone. I'll have to try once I get home.
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Old 12-17-2011, 01:42 PM   #5
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You and I agree on almost everything but this one. Read up about it and will definitely stick to VFD, Monodrives and the like. With VFD the pressure never goes down to a cut in, and it seems with these devices that you are almost deadheading the pump at low flows or creating unnecessary back pressure on the offset and well pipe. Some people have crappy 125 psi pipe for an offset and it seems this could be a problem. Don't know enough though so I really can't say for sure..... I'll stick to technology with this one! Jim
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Old 12-17-2011, 02:05 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mxz--700
You and I agree on almost everything but this one. Read up about it and will definitely stick to VFD, Monodrives and the like. With VFD the pressure never goes down to a cut in, and it seems with these devices that you are almost deadheading the pump at low flows or creating unnecessary back pressure on the offset and well pipe. Some people have crappy 125 psi pipe for an offset and it seems this could be a problem. Don't know enough though so I really can't say for sure..... I'll stick to technology with this one! Jim
Ive seen alot of drives fail. We install many of these cycle stop valves and never had call backs or any problems, one thing about these cycle stops is they act as mechanical soft starts and mechanical soft stops. And they actually save more energy then drives do. But we never install these valves if we don't know the condition of the piping that we can see. I installed one of these valves on my own house. But use what works for you.

In some situations drives can be a better choice.
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Old 12-17-2011, 11:51 PM   #7
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I'll jump on this one. Cycle stop valves are a crock and most of what is on that web site is misleading information with little or no actual facts to back any of the claims up. Cycle stop valves have been around for a very long time now. The concept is nothing new at all and you have to ask yourself why 99% if well and pump installers are not using this so called miracle valve? I'll tell you why. With a cycle stop valve in place any time someone cracks a faucet or runs any small amount of water which is pretty normal in most homes. Like getting a glass of water for instance. With the cycle stop valve the pump will run every time a faucet uses more than about a half a gallon of water. So where is this thing reducing cycle times? How about a full out draw on the system, say a couple of hoses running? Well, with a cycle stop valve the pump runs the entire time the hoses are running. With a standard tank system the pump also runs the entire time the hoses are running. The scam artists that promote this thing do so because probably 80% of well tank systems are installed using a tank that is too small for the pump which will cause problems with cycling but had the installer properly sized the tank a tank system will outperform a CSV any day of the week. Also try and find a single pump or tank manufacturer that endorses them or is offering them in their product lines. It's old and dated technology at best and a scam at worst.
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Old 12-18-2011, 12:19 AM   #8
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If you look many pump and motor manurfactures cover the use of the valve on thier product, in their warranty.

Cycling creates pressure surges that damage plumbing. Also not to mention those valves surpress bounceback, bounceback slams check valves shut and creates damaging pressure surges. I've Personly installed and serviced many of those valves and they are great IMO. I even have one on my own house. Alot of those valves are installed around here. And in quite a few commercial aplications.

one cycle refers to one cutin and cutoff the pump. It's better for the pump to constantly run then cycle.
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Old 12-18-2011, 01:13 PM   #9
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Ok sounds good. Now do a side by side comparison of cycle times using a stop valve and a PROPERLY sized expansion tank. What you will find is that there is very little difference at all and many times the tank system will show far less cycles than the stop valve system will. Ask Carey to send you 3rd party, documented proof of performance. (good luck with that )
Barret has been manufacturing these things for many years, long before cycle stop got involved. They were and still are used extensively on irrigation systems where the pump RUNS ALMOST CONSTANTLY to provide a buffer against the possibility of cycling should outlet pressures fluctuate. In a residential application they are an expense that makes no sense. Better yet, give the boys at Goulds a call and they will gladly fill you in. Carey likes to go around telling everyone that pump manufacturers don't like them because they like selling pumps. That's an outright lie. But here's the real proof. I have had the same goulds 1/2hp 10 gpm submersible in my well for 34 years now with a Well X trol 202 tank that is just as old. 6 people in the house, no issues.

Properly sized and properly installed a standard pump set will last for many years.
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Old 12-18-2011, 01:45 PM   #10
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From what I understand they work OK as long as you install them with plumbers putty.
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