Originally Posted by Master Mark

..........
I have read that both Rheem and Bradford White both have cried foul
a long time ago becasue American heaters was allowed to modify their heaters
after the class action lawsuit but did they not have to pass the antsi and ul standards on the new design...

Originally Posted by Pipedoc

Alright, I'll be the one to say it and take all of the heat.

This is old news.

American made a big mistake with the putting the thermal fuse in-line in the thermocouple. They have paid for it through the class action suit (as they should have) for this horrible design and have since changed to a thermal switch. They are no longer the same product that brought about the lawsuit. Why are we all talking about them as if they are still the same product?

Right now I beleive Rheem to be the biggest piece of junk a on the market with their TRD and a flame arrestor that seems impossible to clean. I won't be a bit surprised if I hear about a class action suit against them. (If I was an attorney I would have already filed that money maker in court.)

I beleive Bradford has the best product on the market even though their flame arrestor can't be adequitly cleaned in my opinion.

Every manufacturer has a flame arrestor on their heater and they are all susceptable to lint and dust. Some more so than others (only because of size) but again, they are all susceptable.

The advantage that every other manufacturer has over Rheem and Bradford on their flame arrestors is they are easy to clean with satisfactory results. If American or A.O. Smith or State or any of the others would change to a full size arrestor like Bradford I beleive they would have a better product.

I have seen FVIR shutdowns on every brand of heater that is sold in my area, including Bradford White.

I still beleive the problem could be all but completely resolved by using a design like Bradford White's where the make-up air enters the heater through the side of the jacket and adding a pleated filter to prevent dust and lint from being sucked into the unit and down to the flame arrestor. It works for my furnace. Why not my water heater?

Dunbars customer should have called him in the first place instead of compounding their problems and using a handyclown that cost them even more money in the long run. I don't see how that is the fault of American.

[slips on body armor and enters the bunker] Okay, fire at will.

Originally Posted by Pipedoc

Alright, I'll be the one to say it and take all of the heat.

This is old news.

American made a big mistake with the putting the thermal fuse in-line in the thermocouple. They have paid for it through the class action suit (as they should have) for this horrible design and have since changed to a thermal switch. They are no longer the same product that brought about the lawsuit. Why are we all talking about them as if they are still the same product?

[slips on body armor and enters the bunker] Okay, fire at will.

Originally Posted by Protech

That's what my preimier/american heaters have. It can be removed for cleaning to, just like a reusable furnace filter.

Originally Posted by Redwood

Thats just it Pipedoc...

It still is the same old product...

The air inlet is still so small that it acts like a vacuum cleaner because of the high flow volume. It is still too close to the floor. For those that have the filter wrapping the base it is a little better but still requires higher maintenance than a home owner will provide in most cases. The retrofit kit and the changes from the FG to BFG models while it did eliminate the thermal fuse in the thermocouple did nothing to fix the basic design error of the Flame Lock, Flame Guard FVIR Systems and that is the design of the air inlet and screen size. The fixed models are now experiencing a rash of gas valve failures due to the frequent trips of the FVIR and they have band-aided that with a new and improved gas valve.

The basic problem is that when the homeowner gets up in the morning and turns on the hot tap, hot water should come out! It should not be a I wonder if I have hot water today. With Bradford White there is virtually no wondering while American's tend to be a lot less reliable.



While they have the wrap around filter the inlet through the base pan has not changed.

Originally Posted by Pipedoc

I agree that the flame arrestor is too small. Every heater out there is too small except for Bradford White. Bradford White has the same problem though. I clean plenty of these as well. They don't clog as fast because their arresto is larger but they do clog.

Originally Posted by Pipedoc

Mark,
Would you please site a source on this? I am most interested in reading this.

Originally Posted by Plumber Jim

I have not had a problem with the bradfords clogging but believe it's a matter of time. How do you go about cleaning the bradford white flame arrestors?